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14 June 2012


I've been happy to watch Maryland's emergence after some rocky years as a solid and improving program.

Is Delaware next to the ACRL? It would seem to be a logical fit given the location of the school and Delaware's size and relatively strong academics (comparable to Va Tech, Wake Forest, NC State, and Maryland).

East Coast - just spat coffee all over my keyboard.

If you are saying "not a chance" because Delaware does not have a D-1A football team (if that matters), I guess that is true (Delaware football is only D-1AA). If you are disputing the academic comps, that's not valid. According to the US News and World Reports rankings of National Universities, Delaware is #75. NC State is #101, and Florida State ties NC State at #101. Va Tech is ranked #71. Maryland is #55. And Clemson comes in at #68. So Delaware is right in that mix as a national university. And if you are saying "not a chance" because of rugby product, well, I guess you aren't- can't be - saying that. Delaware would step into the ACRL as a top three team right off the bat.

So with Navy leaving Rugby East, any word on if Penn State will now opt for the Big Ten? or maybe they head to the ACLR too? The Big Ten's facebook page has 10 members listed and Penn State currently is still not one of them. Curious to see where they'd go. I'd personally like to see them in the ACLR first over the Big Ten. And with Navy it would be better competition for them.


Sorry, biffed the link.


If the Delaware's much less the Kutztown's, Ark St's or Life's and Davenport's are waiting for a USAR meeting to sort out their futures they are wasting time. USAR will never regain what they are losing daily from college rugby. Big pieces of the country are doing their own thing. They are no longer waiting for Boulder or their TU/GU's to tell them what is OK and what's not.

USAR has only one hand to play and that's to say sure do your own thing we support it. USAR will need to make this their idea in the first place, "we are supporting what the teams want". The problem is this will leave the above schools hung out to dry. They will need to slap together some really unappealing rugby conferences and focus their play for a three weekend USAR national championship. The NAIA and D2 school won't be able to make their rep beating the big brand name universities in conference play. There will be more Life vs Ark St matches that although well played, nevertheless played in front of 150 fans and reported on in rugby websites only.

What these "rugby" schools better hope for is the brand names schools with good rugby teams like Cal and BYU continue to play them. These schools beat the Life's and Ark St's so unlike the other brand names with lesser rugby teams they might still be willing to play the South Africans. If not, the USAR XV national champions will be like the USAR 7's at Texas A&M (really bad), while the other teams will play in something closer to the CRC (really good) only in a XV format.

Waiting for the USAR crew to straighten any of this out is a pipe dream. Davenport, Life and Arkansas State had better be on the phone with Kutztown and the like to build their rugby conference, because these schools offer nothing to where college rugby is headed. Their best hope is each other.

Jack Clark must be laughing in his rugby bunker in Berkley. First he invents the CPD and leaves after one year, then he watches it crash and burn and fall right into his conference centric project. As soon as one or two more teams jump ship he will declare conference centric collegiate rugby the cornerstone of American collegiate rugby guaranteed to be a commercial bonanza.


Jack Clark wins the D1-AA (conference centric) championship and doesn't get the revenue from the championship match and drops out of D1-AA saying that 7s and international tours will now be the focus of Cal's rugby program touting the World Cup competition (25 miles over USA border into Canada) as the pinnacle of North American Collegiate Rugby.

Big-10 rugby has to happen and not just in the Fall, but in the main XV season in the Spring.

Big-10 champions verses Pac-12. Maybe an eight team tournament of four of each conference.

PSU, OSU v Cal, Utah is the type of scheduling which could get some eyeballs.

I'm no hater, these teams could still play the chiropractic school, but if we are going to get on TV don't we need to think about this stuff?

Great to see strong leadership at ACRL and a few other conferences. No need to wait for USAR to improve rugby. The college conferences should take over running representative side competitions as well. Hopefully more college conferences will take the lead in the development of rugby in their regions.

Big10 - you talking 7's or 15's for your B10 vs Pac12 idea?

7's is the only thing that would work in my opinion. I think Pac12 is about 10 years ahead of the Big10 when it comes to 15's and would not be as commercially viable as sevens.

I don't think JC started the ACC, SEC or any of the conferences, except maybe the newest one the Pac12. In fact, the Pac12 might be late to the party. I'm pretty sure that large chunks of the country are thinking pretty well for themselves. What we are seeing is a strong backlash to USAR. The USAR dues and leadership "value proposition" just isn't there. Navy isn't following anyone, they are running as fast as possible away from USAR. Along with the Big10 and Pac12 teams. It is universal that teams are fed up with USAR brand of management. The meeting taking place in Houston will provide more questions than answers. If a breakaway competition happens teams will be clawing at getting into it and away from anything having to do with USAR.

It is interesting that while people are clamoring to get college football away from being so conference focused, and trying to campaign for a national tournament, for some reason people in rugby circles are trying to follow what football is trying to move away form.

BCS college football is somewhat moving away from the NCAA conference setup because they are the reason college football is a multi-billion dollar industry. The conference set up worked for a long time, and still works for schools that do not have the financial horsepower of the Texas, Michigan, and Ohio State football programs of the world.

I think this is a great move for rugby, especially if the conferences are run by quality administrators. Having an 18-22 year old college kid in charge of administering a competitive sports league doesn't work.

You are entitled to your opinion; I'm entitled to a valid email. Since you declined to provide one, your opinion has been unpublished.


"There will be more Life vs Ark St matches that although well played, nevertheless played in front of 150 fans and reported on in rugby websites only."

Yes, because when brand schools play each other there's always a huuuuuuge crowd, right? And that sh*t is always on the front page of the local newspaper and on the lips of every student on campus.

BYU just opted out of D1A post-season...the dominoes begin to fall.


So will ArkSt go to the SEC Rugby Conf or the Allied RC?

Looks like BYU is leaving the D1A

Looks like the glory years of Davenport are over.


D1A Final - Life vs. Arkansas State
Attendance - 1200

D1AA Final - Cal vs. BYU
Attendance - 12,000

Delusional this joker...BYU out of D1-A!

Over a 10 year period we have had two national champions and neither want anything to do with USAR. The best teams are out, many of the next best teams are out. The only people delusional about college rugby teams coast to coast being fed up with USAR management and leadership are the insiders at USAR and the coaches of a handful of colleges.

The good news is knowing all this was happening USAR scheduled a meeting a month ago for next week. Way to react Boulder.

You did not include Air Force who won in 2003.

BYU out; Cal out. Next?

Look for a number of D1AA teams to move into D1A now that that is the only place where they can win a national championship. Calling Davenport, Lindenwood(?), et al.

@Game Time
Those attendance numbers seem a bit generous, but also seem as off-kilter as the actual 2012 attendance numbers for the Super League final and the Men's D-1 final!

Life and Davenport overplayed their hand with older non-student rugby teams and USAR allowed it to happen. Ark St fields an all-foreign team. These teams are now free to be the USAR postcard for college rugby, while the rest of college rugby heads elsewhere.


1,200 for Life vs. ASU would be a stretch.

Wait there is still hope for D1a. Texas Tech and Sam Houston have committed to D1a. Texas says they are going to play in both D1aa and D1a. Its finally coming together :-)

Not sure why people on GL assume BYU and Cal are going D1AA. I think they may just be going.

This quote from Smyth doesn't sound like a D1aa future to me.

"come to the conclusion that we should evaluate other options for the post-season.”

Let's just get the best playing the best, and start developing some Eagles!

Cal and BYU to the RSL instead of blowing out teams 100-zip. Big time collegiate rugby isn't right around the corner, so let's stop F'ing around and get some competitive matches going in this world rugby backwater we call the USA!

I am struck by how much this changes the discussion. Navy leaves and they are cowards, afraid of Life (even though they didn't play in the same conference), but now that BYU leaves it is hard to make this same coward argument.

If Cal are together with BYU how many other teams would it take to create a new post season championship? Two more and they have a better championship product than USA Rugby. Six good teams join them and its a lock. A 16 team post season of the good named brand schools would be a far better product than the Central Washington vs Life final.

How did Nigel Melville and the board of director flag this up this bad?

"How did Nigel Melville and the board of director flag this up this bad?"

Jack Clark dreamed up the premier division concept and then bailed as soon as it didn't put dollars in his program's pocket. USA Rugby and Nigel had little to do with it other than to agree to sanction/facilitate the competition.

BYU and Cal are developing Eagles at a rate faster than most in club rugby. So does this mean that club rugby needs BYU and Cal to help them develop their players? We don't need BYU and Cal in the RSL. We need 10 more BYU's and Cal's, along with the NAIA rugby academies as long as they're playing US eligible players that aren't 27 in college.

And what we really need is more CRC type events with TV and sponsors so we can attract more athletes and resources to the game.

"And what we really need is more CRC type events with TV and sponsors so we can attract more athletes and resources to the game."

You mean invitational 15s competitions on TV with brand name teams like Texas, Ohio State, Notre Dame, etc? Those teams stink and it will not help to develop Eagles.

A national college playoff structure should be developed by the college conferences working directly with each other. No need for USAR to get involved. Same is true for a competition for representative all-conference teams.

@Let's do this,
Those teams "stink" now, but watch how fast they get better when television exposure is available. Texas is actually a great example. Their rugby program has taken massive strides forward in the last two years, primarily because of their participation in the CRC. All the best high school players will want to go to schools that are playing on tv in events like the CRC. Then you will see these teams rapidly improve. That's the way college sports works.

RE: RSL & College Programs

Don't kid yourselves. If the folks behind the CRC and USA Sevens in Vegas were to announce they are teaming up with NBC to have a RSL competition televised and have sponsors in tow, you would see Jack Clark and the folks at BYU spinning the reason why they should be in the competition. It's about the money.

@ Let's do it

My team played in the CPL/CPD/D1-A both years. Some points of clarification. USAR owned the competition and the teams were to be partners with them. This was JC mistake, he gave Melville the competition to run with the teams as equal partners. Once again, a huge mistake. When USAR draped the final in Emirates banners both years (a usar sponsor, not a college sponsor) it was a good indication. Melville and his man Bell were to hire a sponsorship agent. Then they decided to do it themselves which didn't work out so well. Then they hired an agency, who never sold anything. USAR did pay to produce the semis and final for a tape delayed espnu show. These purchases were not cheap. USAR also supported the competition with travel grants this past season. The year before they helped the semi teams. Sorry to bust your bubble on hating on JC, but Cal was the only semi team not to take the travel money. But he was outspoken about there being 12,000 paying fans to the first final and the CPD teams saw nothing. USAR just kept the funds. Fact, USAR collects a million dollars of college dues. As much as this is biting the hand that's feeding us, it isn't fair to take dues money from d1aa, d2 and d3 college rugby and give it to d1a.

No gun was put to my team's head to join the CPL. Unlike Cal and Dartmouth, Tennessee etc who left after the first year we stayed because it still looked like our best option. With the recent drops it looks to be over or at least changed. If USAR keeps offering funds to be in the d1a we will stay. For my team it is less about a championship and more about the funding and remaining in the upper division. Right or wrong we received 20% of our total budget from USAR.

It's a good question just how prominently the D1A Final figured in USAR's plans. Without BYU or Utah as a draw, you'll never see the final at Rio Tinto again. USAR used the gate from the final to finance the whole "festival" of championships.

I'm guessing that USAR is not going to do television broadcasts of any more college rugby since they've shown repeatedly that they can't recruit enough sponsors to pay for them. Instead, single, or for larger events, multi-camera Webcasts will become the norm.

I'd have to say that the era of USAR-owned college playoffs generating large crowds and promising substantial revenues is over.

When college playoffs are budget-draining cost centers, you'll see any playoffs put on by USAR done as cheaply as possible.


I coach a D2 team with 44 players and 4 coaches meaning we pay 48 x $40 CIPP = $1920 + $150 club fee for a total of $2070 in fees to USA Rugby. Glad you got to pocket some of our money because we don't get S#!T

Why is it a bad thing to want more money, fans, TV and sponsors for rugby? Isn't this what's behind everything good going on in American rugby, like the CRC. If the USA v Georgia match was on national TV with a sellout crowd and big name sponsors wouldn't we be happy? Are we so downtrodden we only think we deserve a bad internet feed?

BYU leaving will create an opportunity for a national college rugby product to be formed. This will assist the new conferences in their development.

"BYU leaving will create an opportunity for a national college rugby product to be formed. This will assist the new conferences in their development."

This is the same things that were said when the CPL (CPD? D1-A? whatever) was created. Same desire; same non-pan. USA & Rugby = Oil & Water


Bet there will still be large college rugby events at RT. Even bigger events with crowds 12-15k, just not owned by USAR.

12k @ $25 per ticket = $300,000, before sponsorships. Coupled with an attractive semifinals setup college rugby championships can be a $500k business. This is enough to cover the participates cost and bankroll some sustainability. It isn't enough to pay for Nigel's $300k salary, but it could pay for itself.

8 teams, 7 matches x $30k ($15k each) per match in team expense = $210,000.

Very workable. Could even be a team dividend.

@college fan

Do these 12K spectators just appear out of nowhere? You plug in the number like it isn't a variable. I sure hope you are not operating a business.

Sorry, Realist points out something I forgot. The other option is status quo, its a little more expensive with less upside, but its an option.

I guess BYU isn't taking this path.

Mate, its just the number that showed up when BYU played Cal in a poorly promoted championship match, so yes, its a plug number. I think it could be much higher but its doesn't need to be so to make the point.

I know this seems like a simplistic question, but why don't BYU just schedule Cal at Rio Tinto on, say, the 2nd Saturday in May and play for, I don't know, maybe the loser pays for lunch. Does anybody believe that USAR showing up with $2 medals and a $200 trophy would get one fan more into the stadium? I really don't care what they call it. Cal vs BYU is going to generate a big crowd and by scheduling it way in advance you can minimize travel costs and maximize marketing. Why do they even need other teams? I'm just sayin'.


Maybe you're right, but why not include some of the other better teams like Utah, Army, Navy, PSU, St Mary's etc. There must be 8-12-16 really good teams with strong brands which could add to the competition and greatly benefit from participating.

Some might not want to, others would jump at the chance. It would be sold as a national championship in the same way the CRC is, only it would be a more bona fide championship. Quarters, semis and finals. As you say, scheduled in advance to maximize marketing. I like it.

Remember, USAR will continue on with their championships so the Life and Davenports will be just fine.

Not that I'm against the other teams playing and I don't doubt that it might even constitute the "real" national championship, but a "challenge match" has one big advantage in marketing over a tournament-style thingey=>you know who's going to be playing. You can print posters. You can do a definitive build-up without the unknown of just who's gonna be in the final.

For the purposes of this exercise, other teams just get in the way of maximizing the impact of the match. There's no doubt that BYU and Cal are going to put on a rousing, well-played and, I might add, very physical contest. It would really be ideal for a broadcast, since the underlying story lines could be developed. There'd be plenty of time to prepare human interest "back stories" since, again, we know who'd be playing. Getting other teams involved just confuses the branding and delays the big marketing push until the final teams are known, reducing the effective to push to less than a week instead of months. Just sayin'.

"Jack Clark dreamed up the premier division concept and then bailed as soon as it didn't put dollars in his program's pocket. USA Rugby and Nigel had little to do with it other than to agree to sanction/facilitate the competition."

You're not allowed to say that on a site that thinks USA Rugby only does wrong.

"I coach a D2 team with 44 players and 4 coaches meaning we pay 48 x $40 CIPP = $1920 + $150 club fee for a total of $2070 in fees to USA Rugby. Glad you got to pocket some of our money because we don't get S#!T"

^This is a perfect example of how delusional and dense the college folks are.

Even aD2 school gets:
-Tens of thousands of dollars on playoff events (if good enough to qualify; though the tea partiers that love this board probably think that only the teams who make it should pay)
-Tens of thousands of dollars in staffing, equipment, and referees for playoff events
-Individual player accident insurance (contrary to popular belief, not all colleges require kids to have insurance; of course, again, the tea partiers here don't care)
-Club liability insurance
(again, not all colleges offer this for their clubs)
-Coach and referee courses and development (not fully paid for by course fees, they're made cheaper by dues in the general fund)
-Credibility by being associated with the national governing body of an olympic sport
-Funding for the All-American program and U20 program, which develop future Eagles and often return players to schools with high performance skills and knowledge
-Office space and staffing for necessary administrative functions (accounting, registration, etc.)

I was a part of a group that looked to break off from USA Rugby a few years back - when college clubs gave even less because dues were lower without accident insurance - and we could never make the numbers work. We always wound up with a budget that was going to charge more to members without as many administrative perks. A million dollars might be a lot to think about in dues overall, but it doesn't get very far in having professionals run the college game. Rental and insurance on stadiums for events alone would be a huge burden on the budget - just ask USA Sevens how they go about getting their insurance.

It's probably easier to demand accountability from USAR than to blow everything up and think and it will work better. I'm really puzzled as to how rugby wins without cooperation between its various arms.


Our program went to three national championships in Florida and New Mexico (about 25K per trip cost to our club, which put us in debt to some generous coaches for a few years). Average to poor refs from the LAU/TU, balloon airfield was the venue in New Mexico, no real atmosphere or facilities (team was still kitting up and taped on the sideline and there were no showers), some kick-offs were at 9AM, we don't need the insurance, ref and coaching clinics require additional fees and only happen once ever couple years in our LAU/TU, we have had a couple guys go through the age grade system and become All Americans and they always need to raise funds to participate (our club/alumni donate and the LAU kicked in a couple hundred). The over 2K we put in is more than half of the annual budget we get from the university and it is only the beginning as the LAU/TU dues (fees) are another 1200 or 1300 and the ref fees to the local society are 800 or 900. Basically the day after we get our funding from the university, we pay our dues and fees and are in debt.

Net Net the cost don't get you much.

Your club will have to travel for games no matter who you're associated with - you've gotta be kidding yourself if you factor those as USA Rugby costs. National tournaments also get the best refs in the country flown in, so if you think the refs were poor you probably either think every ref is poor or your team was a very low priority for the refs in attendance (D2 gets lesser refs than D1, for example).

Costs will increase with the facilities you want, btw, you clearly have the popular teabagging view on insurance, you completely missed the part where I noted that ref/coach courses are subsidized by dues (they'd be more expensive without), discarded all that goes into ref/coach development (like flying around evaluators), *again* missed how dues partially subsidize high performance travel (players have to pay, yes, but they'd pay a lot more without dues money).

Also, we didn't even get 2K from the school I attended, but I never complained. It costs money to play sports, and it's not like you'll magically get a better ROI on the 2K you think is lost by going rogue (at higher cost) and hurting the overall game in this country.

Last I checked my daughter's soccer team probably pays (combined) well over $4000 in registration fees for elementary school-aged recreational league soccer (and that's before photos, jerseys, etc.), but nobody's getting outraged about the costs involved there. It's kind of funny to think that egotistical college schmucks get upset more than those involved in little girls' sports. It costs money to play sports - get over yourselves. In Australia I think it costs $250 to be registered with the ARU.


Don't you have work to do in Boulder? I mean the IRB is in the country for the JWRT in Salt Lake City. Don't you have to felate some old geezer in a blazer and tie to make sure Daddy keeps your organization in grant money?

Oh, yes - because everyone who disagrees with the schmucks involved with college rugby works for USA Rugby. That's right, I forgot. Heaven forbid I just be a senior club player and high school coach who's listened to the nonsense coming from the colleges for over nearly two decades.


I don't know what you're beef is with college rugby, but I can tell you this. We raise 20 to 30K per season to run as professional a program as possible. We (coaches and alumni) make sure the team is kitted out as a team, travel to all functions in buses or vans, have a dedicate athletic trainer that attends games and one training per week, a local sports medicine partner with two dedicated orthopedic surgeons and a rehab facility, we use the universities athletic department facilities and we are in very good standing with the university. All I am telling you is that 4K a year we don't get much of anything tangible. The insurance or clinics or whatever does not really improve things for the team, and we get ZERO assistance from USA Rugby or our LAU/TU regarding improving our ability to seduce the administration to think rugby is something to invest in as a global game. Even when our guys make the All-American side all they do is send the university a 99 cent certificate with their logo on it.


Sounds like you have some experience in this area.

"I don't need car insurance, I've never been in a car accident."

"I don't need health insurance, I'm never sick."

"The insurance or clinics or whatever does not really improve things for the team,"

These statements are all the same statement, and are all flawed. You might not have been in a car accident, you might not have been sick enough to need a doctor, you might not have had a catastrophic injury on the field, but once you do, USAR's insurance will be a pretty large benefit to your team: it will still exist, which is likely more than you could say if you cost your university a few million dollars in an insurance settlement.

Until rugby becomes an NCAA sport for men and women, you're going to have to work with USAR. There has to be a governing body - NO sport in the US operates without one. Check my link, it's for real.

South Park
And you continually ignore the point. The point is: USAR, in its infinite wisdom has made a set of really non-responsive decisions that benefit it as a bureaucracy rather than the teams it purports to serve. When the man says the benefits USAR has selected to provide don't meet his needs, you tell him that he just doesn't understand the situation. I can just see you patting him on the head like a slow child who can't seem to spell the assigned word correctly.

Well, the point is that colleges want and need help to persuade their administrations that they're relevant. Where is the slick Powerpoint presentation with outrageous graphics that they can adapt to their needs in making on-campus presentations? Where are the best practices manuals that allow teams to avoid re-inventing the wheel when trying to Webcast their matches to fans? Where is the "how to market rugby to your college community" tutorial, with sample Web pages, even complete "edit this and you're on the air" Web sites that teams could use to let their fans in on what's happening with the team? Sample game programs? A guide for prospecting for sponsors? Dos and don'ts for keeping track of and milking alumni? Where are any of the things that the coaches have asked for over and over that USAR ignores because they don't add to Boulder's bottom line?

There are a thousand things USAR COULD DO that the colleges actually WANT and individually and collectively NEED, and, surprise,they show up with insurance that most of us find irrelevant.

That, I believe, was what he was getting at.

@Run for congress - that's fine, but that misses my point. The insurance is something you need, whether you realize it or want to admit it or not. It's not irrelevant when someone gets hurt, even if you have health insurance already. It protects players, the coaches, the referees and everyone associated with each club involved.

I will gladly admit that I was going after a singular point often made here, that teams get nothing in return for CIPP, and not trying to answer every one of D2's statements.

If D2 Dummy wants all of the things from USAR that you mention, he or she has to work with them to get it. Your ideas and requests are great, and hopefully the new collegiate directors will come through with some of them, but you'll have to work with USAR to get them, not hope they will be done without asking.

The Risk Management department at our university looked at the liability and insurance policies and said, "It's a reasonable price, but not a replacement to our existing coverage. We don't object to the team purchasing it, but we will not use it as a primary option or funds the purchase. "
Basically, we don't need it.

Liability and accident


South Park
I have repeatedly asked for the "best practices" stuff, even offered to help prepare it. I always get the same reaction you offered, good idea, we'll look into it and get back to you. It's now been three years I've been trying to get the "college department" or, in fact, ANY department at USAR to pay attention to the REAL needs of the college community. I'm not stupid. I know that they need repeated reminding, but there came a point when I realized that they really didn't care about our needs, but were instead focused on the needs of the Eagles and Junior Eagles. We were only a means to that end and if we sucked any resources from carrying forward that goal, the WE were an (unwarranted) distraction.

Well, pardon me, but I'm fed up with their platitudinous placation. If they don't care about us, then I refuse to care about (and support them). Hence the moniker I've been using.

So Paul Meyers, are you going to run for Congress? Doubt you'd get elected.

There are plenty more of us around Utah that would say the same thing.

Guess you'll have to find something elset to do in your retirement. Please god find something so you'll stop wasting everyone's time on here.

I think Rich Cortez will make be making that stuff a priority. He has said so himself. So that's good.

Well, Todd Bell was worthless so it doesn't surprise me he couldn't get that stuff done. I'm not sure who else (besides the college dept) anyone would expect to create such items, but hopefully you find someone because even I agree that those are good ideas. Let's hope Mr. Cortez is up to the task.

Why do you think USA rugby owes you a handout?

Why do you think USA rugby has the silver bullet that will make an admInistration all of a sudden say "wow, rugby is great. Let's make it varsity"? Remember, USAR has to cater to ALL schools. Do you assume that just because one tactic works at one school (let's say BYU for Paul Meyers sake), that it will work at USC? No!

Great that BYU has figured out a web cast, web site, twitter, etc. Now go do it at your school!

"But we don't have any money, and I'm a volunteer coach" I hear you say. So what!! Find more coaches to help! Organize your alumni to create an endowment so you can hire a coach! It's not rocket science!

Run for congress - Paul Meyers,

Maybe it's because the "constant reminding" you give USAR makes you look like a prick, and no one wants to help a prick like you out.

Work WITH people, don't kick and scream like a baby on Internet boards and think you'll get your way.

Please run for congress here in UT so you can be defeated in an election and go away.

insurance is worthless to 90% of the college teams, all we are doing is subsidizing the clubs, more people lower price. Most NGB have an opt-out, not USAR.

USAR is the only NGB with a mandatory college dues requirement. Tennis, Basketball, Baseball, Rowing, Softball, Swimming, Field Hockey, Soccer, Football, Track&Field...done of these NGB's charge a dues fees.

Some people need to quit offering the cost of the kids mini soccer it isn't applicable to college sport and dues.

USAR does not deserve dues money from college kids. They are crooks paying way to much salary to a poor CEO and a poor staff. Cut that payroll in half. Elimination dues on HS and college kids. Increase the dues on post-college adults if they are willing to pay it. USAR, quit taking credit for growing the HS and college game when all you are doing is holding it back.

USAR needs to retool their mission and books.

- I'd like to see how you reached that 90% statistic.

How exactly is USAR holding back HS & College rugby? This is a statement from someone who clearly has no idea of how an organization like USAR works.

If USAR were to retool their mission, what would it be? They are here to grow the game, at all levels. More people play rugby now than ever before... so if they shouldn't do that, what should they do?

What is the mission of the USAR college department? Those ideas by Mr. Meyers, if that is really him, seem pretty good to me. If the college department isn't in charge of collecting and distributing "best practices" stuff, then who is? Why is it being grumpy to suggest that the college guys help gather info from the programs that seem to know what they're doing in a few areas and publish it so we can all benefit. It might not work at my school, but it damn well might.

In my experience, there are a lot of details that we could maybe learn about from others. I'd like to anyways. Maybe "Grumpy Old Men" or "Jack Sparrow" already know it all and are using this here forum to share all their wisdom with us. I'll wait right here to hear from you.

Of course there are ideas you could learn from others. So call up Paul Meyers at BYU and ASK him how e got a webcast going!

Why do you need USAR to wipe your ass for you? Be a big boy and take class at your local community college if you can get in.

USAR and especially the college folks are too busy trying to sort out the mess that egotistical coaches like Smyth and Clark have made of the competition system.

People are having delusions of grandure and it's bad for rugby. Get over yourselves.

USAR isn't "holding back" HS/Age-Grade rugby. It barely seems to be able to catch up with what's happening there. Some of the collegiate conferences seem to be taking a page out of that book as they offer game tape review, best practice tips, program management consultation, uniform and gear discounts, coaching and high performance clinics, etc. All the things that the colleges want (and will need as the Play Rugby initiative participants matriculate to collegiate rugby), but do not get from USAR.

Should the effects of the Play Rugby initiative been thought through to completion and planned for? Sure. But they weren't, so now it's up to the HS & Collegiate program coaches and administrators to evolve the system on their own.

I do not know whats going to happen with college rugby but keep in mind BYU has connections with Dave Checketts and ESPN.

Hey, I know a guy at ESPN too! Does that mean my DII Club is going to get some airtime?

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